Hello! How do I clarify to a consumer and my inventive director that raster pictures actually should not be used as a brand….
The consumer needs a photorealistic picture of layered [x-ray ferns like this](https://www.artwork.com/merchandise/p53761940247-sa-i7036837/albert-koetsier-teal-fern-xray.htm?upi=Q1HR1830&PODConfigID=9664578&sOrigID=13034) however once I tried replicating layered shapes in illustrator my Artistic Director mentioned it is by no means what they’re in search of. They need extra texture and wish it to appear like an x-ray. I managed to recreate one thing in Photoshop that replicated an xray look (Convert to grayscale, regulate ranges and invert)
​
https://preview.redd.it/xvgql0m3m46a1.png?width=506&format=png&auto=webp&s=e68509494b698a33059911231de57ea317505ebe
Nevertheless I do know you by no means use raster based mostly pictures in a brand file.
Is it potential to even get an impact like that in illustrator with out picture tracing?
If you have to explain this to a CD then you should have that job where you work.
Scale it down to a letterhead size or a mobile app size and show your CD how much it doesn’t work. All the detail will be lost once it’s scaled down. Even if you could recreate it in Illustrator, it wouldn’t matter because the detail will be the same size whether it’s vector or raster, it’s too intricate for a logo, that’s the main issue. The other issue is that it’s a poorly thought-out idea that doesn’t make much sense. Does the client company x-ray plants? or what are they trying to convey here?
I usually like to say “It is possible but it will suck in many theoretical and practical ways”
You’re going to have to draw it manually, create the gradient with blends, and release the blends into dozens of shapes. That’s how AT&T did it back when their logo had gradients in it. Explain to the CD that this is going to take a long time to do and the client needs to understand what it will cost if they’re paying by the hour.
I wouldn’t explain it honestly. Just do your work and get paid for it. Entry level jobs, you get this type of job, it’s not worth fighting and explaining modern design. I’ve been through this before. Just leave on good terms and get your experience.
I used to argue this type of stuff too. Has to work black and white. Too many colors in the design. Trajan is not a great typeface for logo design. In the end it just made the employer mad and was a bad experience all around. If I had to do it again, I’d just do the job and get paid and know that I have a bright future ahead
It looks quite sick honestly, but not as a logo. But I definitely feel you can make a logo inspired by this, reduce the amount of details, simplify it and you’ll have a logo!! (I know it’s rasterised rn, but you can create a vector version of this)
In situations like this it’s always better to ‘show not tell’ luckily we have an A1 printer and I’ll mock up a letterhead, business card and A2 sign on a sheet with notes next to them (notes aren’t needed but really hammer home for example ‘required resolution for print, then in red under its actual resolution at that size’ and any other concerns you have, such as clarity, blur loss of detail. Then give it to them for comment. You’ve got a paper trail, they have to ignore it to proceed.
The problem is not the logo being a raster image per see (I mean, I wouldn’t do it, but it could work). The issue I recommend you to focus on and communicate to your client is that the logo needs to be highly and quickly recognizable, under any circumstance. It would probably take me a while to recognize this logo, even if I’m familiar with it, but you can’t even see wtf that is . Try to print it on different applications and sizes, and show it to your client from afar and up close for them to see what you mean. Put the logo on a header of a website mockup too. Set it up as the profile pic on different social media platforms. If your client doesn’t see the problem (because they remember what that is and are having trouble thinking as a person who’s never seen this logo before), show it to people who are not familiar with it. Hell, record their reactions even to show your client.
Go further. Ask your client why it has to be a realistic x-ray. What does that solve? What does that communicate? Is there a better, more effective way to communicate the same? Ask a million questions and take the conversation away from personal taste (theirs is clearly awful). Worst case scenario they don’t give a flying fuck and tell you to do what they tell you to do. At best, they’ll listen to your expertise. At bestest, they’ll think you’re annoying and walk away to look for another designer and you won’t have to work on this logo ever again.
Not scalable! Period! Your CD doesn’t know this? Side thought – imagine this logo as a favicon. Yikes!
Show her the brand identity books for Nike, Starbucks, Jack Daniel’s, Duolingo, and tell her you’ll give her a free logo if she can spot a SINGLE instance of raster images in any of their logos.
‘What does this look like to you?’
“[A greyish blob](https://youtu.be/0RMY28LCTWk?t=18).”
Just do it. This is the level you are at. Then quit and get a better job or you will be that CD in 29 years
Over 30 years in this business as AD,CD, DD and I still have down right nasty discussions to clients and unfortunately folks I work with who even have Senior in their title about this issue and met with blank stares.
Honestly i’d just do what they want and be done.. Then look for a new job
I would show them what happens when you try to use it because it sounds like the client (and CD???) doesn’t understand the ‘why’. Screenshot or export a quick version to help them visualize it, and present alternatives. Put the ball back into the client’s court.
Try putting that Photoshop image through vecteezy and see what happens
ask your client if they need practice feedback about the whole logo idea first. if not just do the task and move on.
Like the slogan, just do it! But specify that the logo cannot be printed larger than the size specified, due to the limitations of the raster image.
Give them what they want. Let them keep wondering why their “logo” looks shitty.
You can try doing variations of the logo.
Different colors, housing it in shapes etc.
then try printing it on the ff: (if permissible)
1. Envelope
2. Letterhead
3. Business card
or make a mock up of folders, brochures, flyers,
even website and/or an app.
Try everything possible that the client will need their logo on.
Sometimes, people need to see all possibilites/options to realize how bad the idea is.
I know it is tedious, but it might help you with your point.
Sometimes when you see it laid out, you understand why it doesn’t work. Print it big, make it social media profile pic and show how it doesn’t work.
Well, frankly, it would matter how it was done, all the detail will be lost depending on the scale. Fine detail, especially in some printing methods, can actually make a logo look like shit if it is scaled to large or too small.
It may be an exercise in futility, but take what you’ve created, whether vector or raster, and reproduce it on on sheet at postage stamp size, again at like 2”, then again at like 8” and see how it holds up. Show that to the CD and the client.
Sometimes you have to give people what they ask for. Meeting the brief, even when it’s a turd sandwich, is part of the job.
You could try to show examples of logos that are inspired of photos. They do exist in the form of line drawings, or linear raster effects where the lines change thickness but off course within logo limits. Buy a logo book to that “CD” for Christmas.
Else make the logo as a photo and print examples of what happens when you scale it up or down etc.
Most people have no clue about the difference between vector and pixel graphics. I have client that I tried to explain it to for +6 years. Now accepted that that “we” always ask for vector graphics and logos from partner brands, but still don’t really understand what it actually means.
Think you must show a comparison between scaling a vector based logo vs a pixel based logo. Use a huge skyscraper banner as the example. Vector = no loss in definition vs pixelbased = huge loss in definition or a monstrosity of a file size.
If it is still not understood, tell it clearly to that wannabe imposter CD that you take no responsibility for the adaptation and usage of this logo – add that it might gonna cost the client money to implement and you will use considerable more time making size versions of the logo. More expensive is a good last resort – it is something that rings a bell with most clients.
And btw your CD should be shot right now 
What is you took a responsive approach? Maybe you could design a strong wordmark that incorporates the fern as an element when the application is appropriate (e.g. in print and on the web, where size permits), but omits the fern when it’s not appropriate (small sizes, single-colour screenprints, etc.)
In answer to your question, no – it’s going to have to be a raster image if you’re including the texture.
Perhaps you could use creative methods of cropping to get it recognisable at a smaller size? Using parts of the entire thing and then perhaps producing that as an almost kinetic logo that grows as it gets bigger?
In answer to your other question, think of it as an exercise in building your own communication skills – It’s an essential soft skill as a Graphic Designer, so I’d take every chance you can to improve it.
A lot of times you’ll find both clients and co-workers (both above and below you) will not know what is basic (and essential) knowledge.
If you can provide a well thought, rational argument as to why they shouldn’t do it (I’d also provide examples to back up the claims) and they still proceed, whatever happens is on them.
At the end of the day, it’s just a job; you don’t have to have your name associated with it if they chose poorly.
Just forget it and move onto the next one.
You can tell them about new edge technology and devices like apple 4k laptop 😉